Chapters 7 and 8 Live Blogging!
Reminders:
(1) Please reference by name to whom you are responding. Ex: I agree with Clay's comment about Gatsby's childlike approach to love, but I think we need to give Gatsby more credit because he is the only character in this novel who stays true to his love.
(2) Please use correct punctuation and spelling (as always).
(3) Hit the F5 key to refresh. You will need to do this continually in order to see everyone's comments.
(4) Try to find a balance between listening to the inner circle and having your own blogging discussion on the outer circle. Please don't abandon the inner circle altogether.
(1) Please reference by name to whom you are responding. Ex: I agree with Clay's comment about Gatsby's childlike approach to love, but I think we need to give Gatsby more credit because he is the only character in this novel who stays true to his love.
(2) Please use correct punctuation and spelling (as always).
(3) Hit the F5 key to refresh. You will need to do this continually in order to see everyone's comments.
(4) Try to find a balance between listening to the inner circle and having your own blogging discussion on the outer circle. Please don't abandon the inner circle altogether.
posted by Kristin L | 1:34 PM
14 Comments:
I agree strongly with the point that Mrs. Kakos made as Daisy seems to be an object that both Tom and Gatsby want to win over. This would suggest that Daisy is the prize, being avaliable only to the stronger (RICHER) man.
To respond to the question of Daisy's love, I think that Daisy truly loved Gatsby before he left for the war but when he left, she was heartbroken. She needed a man to ease her pain and in time, she came to love Tom. Right now, I think she loves both Tom and Gatsby which is why she is so uncomfortable.
Perhaps Daisy enjoys being the "prize" which is why she hasn't made her decision public yet.
THIS IS MATT L'S COMMENT BUT HIS COMPUTER WOULDN'T LET HIM POST:
To address the question about Gatsby's ability to hurt Tom, I think Tom realizes that he has Daisy's love, and Gatsby is just a "has been" in terms of his relationship with Daisy. I don't think that Daisy and Gatsby ever really rekindled their love. Although they may have been in love before they went their separate ways, the relationship they had after they met at Nick's house was phony. I think Gatsby and Daisy enjoyed the idea of being together, but the actuality of being together would not work. Tom realized that Gatsby and DAisy's relationship was doomed to fail, so he did not view Gatsby as a threat to himself.
Yeah...that's a strong point Brian. I think she enjoys not only the attention but the position she is in. Being the love of both Tom and Gatsby, she, in a sense, is continually bribed with money and material objects. This might be judgemental but Daisy is a quite shallow person at points and would therefore enjoy this money coming from two different sources.
I really disagree with Brian when he says that Daisy is a prize and that Gatsby really does not care for her. He has spent his whole life looking for her and he would not waste that unless he loves her.
To some extent I must agree with Matt because Tom allows the two to ride home together, suggesting that Tom realizes he is superior in the situation and has won the loyalty of Daisy. At the same time however, Daisy seems confused and tense during their visit in the hotel which would contradict that idea, causing one to believe that instead she is unsure herself of who she loves (more). Therefore, Tom puts up a strong fight in the hotel, and at the point that he comes out on top, he concludesn the conversation and allows Gatsby and Daisy to ride home together. Why?--I belive that Tom wants Daisy to recognize that he doesn't wish to treat Daisy as a prize and allows Daisy a degree of freedom in their marriage. This act alone unfortunately allows Tom to be quite superior and more mature than Gatsby.
Someone in the inner circle made the point that maybe Gatsby only wants Daisy because he 'can't have her'. I agree with this point, in a sense. I believe that Daisy and Gatsby were in love once, but over time Gatsby's love for who Daisy was as a person shifted to what she represented; instead of loving Daisy, he loved the concept of Daisy, and the personal wealth and decadence she represented.
THIS IS ALSO MATT L'S COMMENT
I would agree with Corey's idea of how Tom and Gatsby both view Daisy as more of an object and not an actual person. This is obviously true of Tom, because of the way he treats Daisy. If he truly cared about her, he certainly would not be involved with other women. As for Gatsby, he has an unhealthy obsession for Daisy, and seems to only want her for his benefit. This is not love, because Gatsby doesn't seem to care about his impact on her, but is interested in what she can do for him.
I agree with Lindsey's idea that money is the way to love and that Fitzgerald thinks that the only way to gain true love is to buy it.
I really liked the comments made by both Sarah and Matt because I believe that the reader sees repetitively throughout the book, characters befriending others simply because it will benefit them. These form not only untruthful but negative relationships. Notably, people often develop 'crushes' for people who they often cannot have. If earning the love or respect of another was easy, crushes would not be so sought after and significant. Great point Sarah!
THIS IS ALSO MATT L'S COMMENT
One of the questions on the inner circle was about the use of the word holocaust. I think that it is an extreme word to use in this circumstance, but to some extent it does have some truth in the novel. There is certainly not horrors or lifechanging traumas, but the events are chaotic and vindictive, but just to a lesser degree.
This book was written before the word Holocaust had the meaning that it has today.
I'm not going to be in class tomorrow to finish up being a discusser, so I'll just blog on here to get my last comment in.
I agree with Kakos and Olivia, that Daisy is a "trophy". I think it started out as she had married Tom, so she belonged to him. But when Gatsby came back from the war, and became successful, I think he only thought of Tom as someone that Daisy married until he could come back and get her. But while Gatsby was away at war, I think Daisy really did fall in love with Tom, just because they got to know each other, and she grew farther and farther apart from Gatsby. So then Gatsby felt like he had to win back her love, and Tom felt like he had to defend his treasure. Soon enough, it stopped being about who Daisy loved more or who loved her more, and started being about who was going to win in the end, and whoever she chose, would be the decided winner. As for Brian's comment that maybe she likes being the "prize", I don't think that's necessarily true; perhaps she just didn't realize how much she really did love Tom (or at least had loved him) until the whole debate came up and she actually started to think about it. But I do see where you're coming from with that, because she grew up rich and probably has always been used to being the center of attention, so if she feels that the light is turning away from her at any time, this new found dilemma surrounding her would not be something she would want to change any time soon.
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